Can some 1 explain this 2 me- birds and bats

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Retarded_at_bio
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Can some 1 explain this 2 me- birds and bats

Post by Retarded_at_bio » Wed Apr 19, 2006 5:37 pm

Can some1 explain 2 me y flying birds can b so much larger than flying bats. What is an adaption that birds have and bats lack? Thank u so much :!: This site roks :!:

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Post by baikuza » Thu Apr 20, 2006 2:13 pm

feather--derivate of the epidermis+endodermis

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Post by Bio_Girl015 » Thu Apr 20, 2006 9:10 pm

Huh...I never thought about it really. Why are birds bigger than bats?...
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Post by flint » Thu Apr 20, 2006 9:24 pm

that depends on the bird and the bat, but bats are much newer to the flying game than birds and thus have not had the time to fine tune the mechanics quite as well as bads have

I cant say what exactly those adaptations are though

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Post by AstusAleator » Fri Apr 21, 2006 3:52 am

Bats can actually get quite large. Look up flying foxes.
I would venture a guess as to the general differences in size though:
First of all bats rely on a petagium, rather than feathers. This means they must diffuse blood out over a larger area, in their wing, than birds. Bird wings, if you were to pluck all the feathers, are just straight appendages, and thus more effecient for blood transfer.
Second: Bats rely on powered flight. Try to think of as many large birds as you can, and see if you can find one that can't glide on wind currents. You will find smaller birds that use powered flight (constantly flapping their wings to stay in the air) but not many large birds. The only large-ish bird I can think of with powered flight is a duck. This ties in with my first point, as powered flight is much less energy-efficient than gliding, and requires a smaller body mass to ensure an adequate rate of Oxygen delivery to muscle.
Third: Bats are mammals, and as such generally have a heavier body-mass than birds. Bat bones are light for mammals, but still heavier than birds. Mammals also have hair, which unlike a birds feathers, is not condusive to flying.

I also agree with flint, in that bats evolved flight much later than birds, and so have not refined it to the degree that birds have.
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Post by Bio_Girl015 » Fri Apr 21, 2006 3:25 pm

Hey, thats pretty cool...i'm now doing my research paper on bats. LOL. Peace.
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Post by Zeneth Entorion » Sat Apr 22, 2006 6:24 pm

I agree with AstusAleator's structural issues above, but... is there actual any evolutionary pressure for bats to be bigger? I mean, most of them eat insects or fruit (with some notable exceptions)- as far as I can see, being bigger would just hamper their agility!

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Post by kiekyon » Sun Apr 23, 2006 10:00 am

Bio_Girl015 wrote:Hey, thats pretty cool...i'm now doing my research paper on bats. LOL. Peace.


take a look at this, then

http://sciencenow.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/full/2006/417/2?etoc

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Post by Bio_Girl015 » Sun Apr 23, 2006 7:27 pm

Awesome link! Thanks kiekyon! This will definitely help me out a lot! Thanks Again! :D

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Post by Darby » Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:14 pm

I don't know that a comparison of timelines is an indicator of anything - evolution doesn't work on a timer, and in several ways (maneuverability, for instance) bats are much better fliers than birds. There are just constraints from being mammals that are unlikely to change compared to what has changed (and not changed from their dinosaur ancestors) in the birds.

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Post by Retarded_at_bio » Wed Apr 26, 2006 11:02 pm

Thanks so much for helping me to understand. I thank all of you so much. Pz out

Cy
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