The Fiber Disease

Human Anatomy, Physiology, and Medicine. Anything human!

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King Cobra
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Post by London » Thu Jul 20, 2006 5:09 pm

Hartuk is a bad Mother!!!!! Don't mess with him. We Love ya Hartuk!!!!
Last edited by London on Thu Jul 20, 2006 11:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

King Cobra
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Post by London » Thu Jul 20, 2006 5:14 pm


this is not that article on the flagella I was referring to, but read this- it goes with what you and Hartuk were talking about:

The interaction between legionellae and free-living amoebae shows strong similarity with processes that occur during infection of mammalian cells by legionellae. In addition, free-living amoebae seem to play a crucial role for persistence and dispersal of legionellae in the environment, and there is convincing evidence that intracellular multiplication of L. pneumophila in free-living amoebae is a prerequisite for the infection of humans. It thus seems conceivable that these intracellular bacterial pathogens have developed and evolved mechanisms for survival in eukaryotic host cells during the interaction with free-living amoebae. This hypothesis of amoebae acting as a (evolutionary) training ground for intracellular bacterial pathogens is further supported by the analysis of chlamydia-related symbionts of free-living amoebae, which still use strategies for host cell interaction that were developed 700 million years ago in interplay with early unicellular eukaryotes (and in the absence of higher, multicellular organisms). Clearly, although other protozoa might have acted in the same manner, the interaction between intracellular bacteria and prokaryotes other than amoebae has rarely been addressed. Future studies should examine obligate and facultative symbionts of other protozoa in order to elucidate the role of unicellular eukaryotes in the transition of free-living bacteria to intracellular bacteria that eventually become able to infect animals and humans. A better understanding of such processes will help to develop novel strategies and targets for vaccines and antibiotics against intracellular bacterial pathogens.

King Cobra
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Post by London » Thu Jul 20, 2006 5:24 pm

okay, last one for me today.....


King Cobra
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Post by London » Thu Jul 20, 2006 6:21 pm

Sorry, but I have to say this...out of all the organizations/ radio stations I have written to re: morgellons, all have written back- even if it was a blanket, computer generated reply.....but not one of my very favorite stations wrote me back....Rense

Nope, Rense did not write me back at all. Maybe this scandal down the middle of this page has some telling signs and reasons....that's too bad, but I guess pharma's kickbacks are too tempting to turn down...?

And, if you look at the top of this will see who owns CNN ah-hah- we will never get any fair coverage!!! oh my gosh, take a look at the first paragraph....from top to bottom of it....this says it all:

WHo owns CNN? MSNBC? ABC? ... omment.php

by John Hammell Friday August 15, 2003 at 09:44 AM
[email protected] 800-333-2553

I do not trust Jeff Rense. He just stabbed me in the back, and I'm wondering if anyone has any info on who owns the Talk Radio Network which is is under contract to? I note that his radio career was initially backed by Paramount Pictures which is an ABC affiliate. He has some major bucks behind him and I'd like to know from where? He is syndicated on over 100 mainstream radio stations, thats the controlled media, he's on the air 18-20 hours per week- that takes megabucks- airtime could be around $145. per hour, it must be astronomically expensive to maintain his website with over 10,000 articles plus archives of all his shows--- who pays for all THAT? I was on his show July 10th, its archived on his site but he's not helping us in the way I feel anyone would if they were GENUINELY "for the people". If he were, he'd have no problem pitching support from the front page of his site to the ANH lawsuit to overturn the EU Food Supplement Directive, but he's not doing that, he's climbed aboard NNFA's pharmaceutically dominated bandwagon and is distracting people with a red herring issue, urging everyone to actively oppose Durbin's bill S.722 even though it has no support and won't even make it out of committee, but its serving to DISTRACT people from the REAL issue which is the need for donations to the ANH lawsuit to overturn the EU Food Supplements Directive which has huge global ramifications- see for info, see to donate and see info. Does anyone know who owns the Talk Radio Network that Rense currently has a contract with? Can anyone tell me anything more about the guy than from what I can learn from his bio and from this painful experience? He has totally turned on me, not something a REAL friend would do.

Let's see, that was: GE and...
.* GE Power Systems: produces turbines for nuclear reactors and power plants.
* GE Plastics: produces military hardware and nuclear power equipment.

oh, this is only the tip of the iceburg....if you read the 2nd paragraph on hyperlink, you will see the carlylse group.......

King Cobra
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Post by Skytroll » Thu Jul 20, 2006 6:27 pm

Ah found a species that does mutate, hence the gene mutation in other species, maybe?

MUTABILITY: The ability of Fusarium AND Pleospora to MUTATE

One of the persistent fears of critics of the proposed use of mycoherbicides is that they can mutate or transform themselves and attack living organisms that they were not specifically intended to attack. The genus Fusarium is notorious for its mutability (its ability to mutate). Even the strain developed by ARS for use against coca (EN-4) must be kept alive on a specialized diet so that mutations will be kept to a minimum. Indeed, the isolate EN-4 as identified by Dr. David Sands is actually a group of mutating strains, as his published literature shows.

When, in early Spring of 1999, Florida's new drug czar, Jim McDonough, fresh from a stint in McCaffrey's ONDCP office introduced the concept of using Fusarium to kill Florida's outdoor Cannabis crop, the response from David Struhs, Head of Florida's Department of Environmental Protection was strong. Struh's sent a letter off to McDonough emphasizing Fusarium's ability to mutate, emphasizing the dangers to Florida's environment. The plan was scrapped.

Definition of "mutate":

Taber's Cyclopedic Medical Dictionary, Edition 18:
1. Change; transformation; instance of such change.

2. Permanent variation in genetic structure with offspring differing from parents in a characteristic; differentiated from gradual variation through many generations.

3. A change in a gene potentially capable of being transmitted to offspring.

Mutation in Fusarium

Mutability in Fusarium: John McPartland slides and lecture.

Mutability of Fusarium according to Dr. David Struhs, Florida's Department of Environmental Protection.

In controlled environments in Petri Dishes

"...the extreme variability of Fusarium species in culture and the fact that they mutate and degenerate rapidly, particularly under conditions of repeated subculturing on common laboratory media.Toxigenic Fusarium Species by Marasas et alia, Penn State U, 1984

Fusarium mutation in Petri Dishes Sands' literature:

EN-4 strain mutation

note the history and when began 1916:
Fusarium infections (July 95)


Members of the genus Fusarium are ubiquitous fungi uncommonly associated with infection. Human infection usually occurs as a result of inoculation of the organism through the body surface, thus causing skin infection, onychomycosis, keratitis, endophthalmitis and arthritis. Fusarium is one of the fungi that can produce micetoma. Dissemination may occur in subjects with underlying immunodeficiency Disseminated fusariosis typically occurs in neutropenic hosts and carries a high mortality rate. Characteristically, a profoundly neutropenic patient has had the abrupt onset of fever, sometimes with myalgia, followed in 66 percent of cases by distinctive skin lesions: multiple sites, predominantly on the extremities, develop painful erythematous macules or papules. Central pallor is followed by necrosis and ulceration. Blood cultures have been positive in 59 percent of cases, including a few that seemed to be due to infected central venous catheters. Amphotericin B is the drug of choice, although it appears to be poor correlation between in vitro susceptibility and clinical response. Prognosis is poor, with a mortality of 76% in the 85 reported cases. Survival was related to the resolution of the neutropenia.

The whole crapload: ... humans.htm

Here is something Americans and Columbians may find interesting and troubling: ... astert.htm

Elevated plasma glycosaminoglycans in chickens with tibial dyschondroplasia induced by a Fusarium oxysporum isolate.
source: ... xicity.htm

This can mutate........


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Post by Cilla » Thu Jul 20, 2006 6:29 pm

Hi Sky,

There are many diseases in which the aetiology is at best unclear and is often frankly unknown. This does not mean that treatment should not be prescribed. Clinicians can prescribe on the basis of symptomatic improvement, and can compare and contrast treatment regimens and their effectiveness with their colleagues.

I do not know what you mean about 'activating' the second X chromosome, and fail to see any relevance in such an idea when we should be discussing obtaining effective diagnoses and treatment, from medical professionals, for this apparently novel clinical condition, i.e. Morgellons disease.

There may be relevance, it is just that I do not know much about genetics, (and nor do I want to, unless I am forced by circumstance to learn).

I do know that there is a condition whereby the afflicted man's chromosomal make up is XXY, so I suppose you could say that the second X is 'activated', (although I am unsure about one being dominant while the other is recessive anyway, in the female. I thought that it was the individual genes that were either dominant or recessive, according to Mendel).

This XXY chromosomal anomaly is known as Klinefelter's syndrome, and the clinical features include the man being of above average height, gynaecomastia, and mental retardation (learning disabilities).

The XYY chromosomal anomaly can be found in asymptomatic men.

There may or may not be a correlation with this anomaly and some cases of psychopathic personality disorder.

Some research established it as being present among a slightly higher proportion of men jailed for violent and aggressive offences, and who were deemed to have this personality disorder, than among the male population as a whole.

Interesting as all of this may be, I think that you should consider the 'little digger', i.e. the dermatophyte, to a much greater degree.

After all, itraconazole is a broad spectrum (azole) antifungal drug, e.g.

Some people are asking their doctors to prescribe this, or another antifungal drug, in order to relieve their symptoms.

The expert medical professionals who do treat this disease do take cognisance of the need (depending on the patient's symptoms) to prescribe antifungal medication, when necessary and clinically warranted. This prescription may be a different antifungal drug from itraconazole.

The dose and length of treatment mentioned in a recent post concerning fluconazole is massive, and would only ever be considered under expert medical supervision, which would include initial and ongoing blood tests, including liver function tests.

These drugs are not sweets. Especially not at these doses, and particularly not when used as part of a regimen of treatment.

It is not 'cutting out the middle man' to engage in any form of self prescribing and imbibing (e.g. in such a massive cumulative dose of fluconazole, particularly as this drug remains in the fatty tissue, continuing to secrete, while the next daily dose would be ingested). I am not saying this would never be prescribed, but only under expert supervision, as already said.

It is not 'cutting out the middle man' to sit with ivermectin, wondering whether to imbibe or not.

It is unclear whether some are imbibing different drugs together at crazy doses. Sooner or later, someone is going to die.

Tam tam is totally careful, and has not done anything wrong whatsoever. He tells you to go to your doctor and request a given drug to be prescribed. Most doctors have agreed, because the suggested treatment is in line with the clinical features, and the patient improves, as we have seen in Hartuk's case.

Some of you think that you can buy all sorts of drugs, including animal ones (in some cases not even those that are licensed for human use at all), and you do not pay any heed whatsoever to the full information concerning each drug, or to the fact that a professional should be in charge of what should be taken when, and for how long, and that all of this is a delicate art depending on an individual's clinical response (which may include an adverse response which may only be elicited by laboratory testing).

It is certainly not Tam tam who is the dangerous person regarding drugs and this condition. He keeps saying, 'ask your GP to prescribe...'.

Others are completely lost, and will not go to a registered healthcare professional for expert help with this condition. I realise that some cannot find one. Please contact Mary at the MRF, and do not stop until you get one.

I sympathise with you all very much, but I also think this self prescribing is getting out of hand, (I am going by what I have read on other sites, and I am horrified at the risks being run by poor desperate people).

I think that you should write about that to the NIH and CDC, because it, in itself is a major health risk, and an utter disgrace. These people would seem to be very ill, yet can sometimes get no help at all!

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Post by Skytroll » Thu Jul 20, 2006 6:43 pm

Dont need the condesending tone.

Natural is not wrong.

When there are no doctors available, one needs to know how to survive.

Also, Amphocerin B used for treatment of fusarium oxysporum.

So, you see there are other things going on.

How about this?

carbon fixation: relates to PH/alkaloid etc. and iron cyanobacteria,
not just fusarium/ but cyanobacteria.

We are getting close, I'd say, plus the big one that did not work on all humans.


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Post by Cilla » Thu Jul 20, 2006 7:10 pm


You cannot go about saying things like that! It does not look anything like the dermatological manifestations of the disease you mentioned.

What it does look like is what it largely is. A complicated fungal dermatitis that responded favourably to itraconazole.


There may be evidence of healing of previous 'callus' type (individual fluke shaped or crescent shaped, formation), as described by Cliff Mickelson. Is that right Hartuk?

It is hard to tell from a photograph, but, (going by what are possibly the healed margins of previous 'callus' formation), could you confirm where exactly the 'principal' callus started?

This may have been in the back of the neck, perhaps secondary to a strange rash, and this may have settled down to a rock like callus embedding itself next to a non-healing lesion that proceeded to spin forth fibers.

I think that you do get apical growth, as well as other callus type lesions embedding themselves in hooks at different points of the scalp.

I think that the allergic reaction set off subcutaneously by dermatophytes and other sharp fibers causes scalp swelling and further fiber growth.

Whatever is true of your case, Hartuk, you have done very well in effecting the healing process to this great extent.

Am I right in thinking that the 'borg' will tend to heal up in the way it started? Back to the basic, or principal, lesion more or less?

Are any areas of callus, or white or clear fibers still present? (They can be very short, or flush against the skin, think in 2 -3 dimensions).

Have the emitting blue fibers ceased? I think that you showed us a photograph of one not so long ago.

Overall, your scalp and neck certainly have responded to treatment so far, which is wonderful.

There is a hair restorer available over the counter that helps to eject foreign material from recovering follicles, allowing the new hair to grow through.

This apparently works, even in the absence of Minoxidil.

If there is still some hard painful 'skin' present, please consult a doctor in the practice of Traditional Chinese Medicine, (provided that you check first with your doctor that this would be acceptable).

The Chinese doctors can prescribe, inter alia, topical creams and hot applications that assist in the removal of such old 'skin cells', as well as in the destruction of subcutaneous larvae or worms that you feel may be present.

They are completely used to treating such conditions, and will not bat an eyelid. Tell this doctor everything that has been postulated about this condition, including Tam tam's theories.

Thank you very very much for sharing your photographs and story. You will be an inspiration for others to seek proper help from knowledgeable doctors.

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Post by Cilla » Thu Jul 20, 2006 7:36 pm

Hi Sky,

Sorry, did not mean to be condescending in my tone. I really don't know about chromosomes.

It might have been the drugs that you meant.

I felt overwhelmed by a black dread that someone is going to kill themselves accidentally, or in real desperation, going out of their minds with pain, and then self prescribing and imbibing from the internet pharmacies.

It is bound to happen sooner or later, because the drugs concerned are very powerful at these doses and combinations.

Some of the things people are being driven to do are utterly shameful.

The CDC and NIH needs to get a move on, because there is terrible suffering going on, especially among those poor people who cannot afford medical intervention.

I am not being condescending here, not at all. These poor people are in this state very often because they have been denied medical help for this condition for years. It's ridiculous! Some have lost everything, absolutely everything, and still they are left without treatment! And some of you cannot understand why I am interested in 'you'. You are correct, it would be weird were I interested 'in you'. It is not 'you', but the terrible calumny and utter disgrace of all of this that I am a bit peeved over.

I will not lie to you, though. If I think that you are wrong in concentrating on matters not germane to the diagnosis and treatment of Morgellons disease I will say so.

I do think that you and London, for whatever reason, are spreading your research wings too wide and too high.

At the very same time, extremely important points about this disease and its analysis and treatment are being utterly ignored.

What we need are more honest photographs of the before and after type as shown by Hartuk. Then sick people will be able to go to their doctor with confidence in their requests.

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Post by Skytroll » Thu Jul 20, 2006 7:50 pm

I will try to compose a very thought out explanation of what historical evidence I have.

Chaos before order.

thank you Cilla, and I have not dismissed Tam Tam at all, never have, and do agree with most of what he says.

I will look at the smaller picture.

In Michigan we are dismissed, so I am on my own anyway. No doctor will even treat for this, because they will not look at it. I have had them covering my arms and was told I was DOP, so even though it is looking them in the face, they will not deal with it.


King Cobra
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Post by Skytroll » Thu Jul 20, 2006 8:11 pm

Many of these dermatophyte things refer back to a person who has aids?

Why is that?

Trichosporon beigelii belongs to the family Cryptococcaceae. This species was formerly known as Trichosporon cutaneum, as it is the etiologic agent of "white piedra," a mild superficial infection of head and pubic hair shafts, most often seen in tropical climates and rarely in temperate areas (1,2). It is widely distributed in the soil of many climates; and it is occasionally found as normal flora of the skin and gastrointestinal tracts. In a normal, healthy individual, T. beigelii is considered a commensal organism rather than a pathogen.

Now, taking this further Cilla I found this:

Dermatophytes Pathophysiology:

The Organism: Three genera of fungi (Trichophyton, Microsporum and Epidermophyton) come from several ecologic sources: geophilic organisms from soil, zoophilic organisms from animals, and anthropophilic organisms from humans ( Table 1).
Morphology: KOH prep of dermatophytes shows thin, translucent septate hyphae with branching. Culture demonstrates thin hyphae with macroconidia and microconidia (fungal spores) that are characteristic for each species.(Figures SD 1,2 & 3).
Dermatophytes produce keratinases that enable them to invade the keratinized layers of the cornified layer and use the keratin as an energy source.

The fungi do not infect mucosal surfaces (e.g. oral or vaginal surfaces) as their epithelium is not keratinized.

Under rare circumstances (in some immunosuppressed and other rare individuals) the fungi can invade into deeper tissues.

Pathologic samples generally similar to acute, subacute or chronic dermatitis (depending on the degree of inflammatory reaction to the fungus), but organisms may be seen in the cornified layer.


Our defenses against dermatophyte infections include:

The skin's natural barrier function.
Skin turnover.
Serum inhibitory factors (SIF).
Cellular immune system (type IV delayed hypersensitivity reaction).
Occlusive clothing and humidity can disrupt skin integrity. Many immunosuppressives (e.g. prednisone) can decrease skin turnover. People who have reduced cellular immunity (via immunosuppressives, diabetes, HIV) are more susceptible to dermatophyte infections.

The organisms can be transmitted from fomites (such as clothing, towels or furniture) or through direct contact with an infected source (in children, often a pet).


OR THIS? ... rmhome.htm

the photo of the month: ... hotos.html

People with aids get this.


King Cobra
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Post by London » Thu Jul 20, 2006 11:16 pm


is that what you think is on our hair? I've seen it but I did not notice the white around it liked your scary photo did- mine was more globular looking with no color. Skytrol, do you think we have this? Yes or No?
I read your hyperlink earlier about it. It said 75% succumb to this if they have it.

Well, that sucks rocks.

Hatuk, Cilla, I honest did not mean anyrthing ugly by the aids comment. I really meant what i said and wanted to project an honest opinion. He knew it was not- at least I thought he said he'd been tested befroe and was negative. I will go remove it right now anyway- that was not my intent at all.

Hey Cilla, when you mentiuoned sky and I spreading our wings too far/ too broad.....could you tell me what in particular I was posting about that was this- or made one think this. I honestly do not know. If it was the water and the ameobae that I posted this a.m. I think that goes perfectly well with this disease. That was the first thing that i noticed about the wholed sci-fi show.

anyway, if you get a chance> shoot me some more of your nice, constructive criticism. I do not mind at all, in fact I learn from it. (Honestly!)

PS: did you guys get a peek at who owns those TV stations? Wild!


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