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Anthropogenic global warming?

Discussion of the distribution and abundance of living organisms and how these properties are affected by interactions between the organisms and their environment

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Postby alextemplet » Fri Jan 09, 2009 4:38 pm

Well, that sounds a bit like some of the educational philosophies over here, where people care more about getting a grade than actually learning anything. It's especially frightening when you see medical students sleeping in class. That's the kind of doctor I want operating on me, one who slept through class. What a good way to keep patients alive.

The problem with our educational system is two-fold. First, it's too highly localized. Although the United States is, overall, a wealthy nation, many parts are relatively poor. Since education here is the responsibility of local governments, poorer communities have no chance at all at having good schools for the simple fact that they can't afford them. This means poor people tend to be less educated, and have less chance of breaking out of poverty. It's a rather vicious cycle, and a nationalized education system would be much better, but that wouldn't fit with of our capitalist philosophy to keep the rich rich at the expense of the poor.

The other problem with our education is that it's too highly politicized. The efforts of our conservatives to enact laws forcing our schools to teach religious creationism (I still don't understand how that's not a violation of religious freedom) is a perfect example of that. Teaching good science and even good facts don't seem to matter quite so much as pushing a political agenda. Although, to be fair, our liberals are just as bad, and not above trying to completely rewrite history for our textbooks. That's beyond sad, in my opinion, to see schools not as educational facilities but as means to brainwash children into believing your particular ideology.

I once heard it said that education should teach you how to think, and not what to think. Too bad more people don't try to put that philosophy into practice.
Generally speaking, the more people talk about "being saved," the further away they actually are from true salvation.

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Re:

Postby David George » Sat Jan 10, 2009 8:58 am

alextemplet wrote:Well, that sounds a bit like some of the educational philosophies over here, where people care more about getting a grade than actually learning anything. It's especially frightening when you see medical students sleeping in class. That's the kind of doctor I want operating on me, one who slept through class. What a good way to keep patients alive.


Yeah very true :lol: :lol:
Thats a really good one Alex.Wonderfull example.

alextemplet wrote:The problem with our educational system is two-fold. First, it's too highly localized. Although the United States is, overall, a wealthy nation, many parts are relatively poor. Since education here is the responsibility of local governments, poorer communities have no chance at all at having good schools for the simple fact that they can't afford them. This means poor people tend to be less educated, and have less chance of breaking out of poverty. It's a rather vicious cycle, and a nationalized education system would be much better, but that wouldn't fit with of our capitalist philosophy to keep the rich rich at the expense of the poor.


Well the problem is the same but the reasons are different here.The government schools are filled with staff who don't teach.They are never updated with the latest happenings although they have a wealth of experience.Its because our system is corrupt.The poor people can only afford to go to government school.But they just end up getting poor knowledge of the subject.And you know the consequences.But still some do come up and serve as examples.So its the same vicious cycle.Until the standards of Government Schools is improved its not possible for any real breakthrough.But i have no comments about capitalism and nationalism.I am really confused about which is better.I like the Chinese for this a communist country with Capitalist cities.

alextemplet wrote:
The other problem with our education is that it's too highly politicized. The efforts of our conservatives to enact laws forcing our schools to teach religious creationism (I still don't understand how that's not a violation of religious freedom) is a perfect example of that. Teaching good science and even good facts don't seem to matter quite so much as pushing a political agenda. Although, to be fair, our liberals are just as bad, and not above trying to completely rewrite history for our textbooks. That's beyond sad, in my opinion, to see schools not as educational facilities but as means to brainwash children into believing your particular ideology.

I once heard it said that education should teach you how to think, and not what to think. Too bad more people don't try to put that philosophy into practice.


Well that debate is not a problem.The supernatural theory is given in the books in school in a small passage along with the other theories for origin.Darwinism and the modern synthetic theory is covered in much more extensively.[like 10 pages i think].Yes education is highly politicized but it doesn't seem to offend popular sentiments and the syllabus is being prescribed by some person close to politicians rather than by scientists.But there are many different types of "boards" in India some of them are prescribed by scientists, which is not generally followed.No one really cares what is in the book, its only the mark or grade that matters.
"Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of evolution"
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Postby MrB » Wed Jan 21, 2009 4:01 am

Clearly humans have had a significant impact on greenhouse gas emissions and as a result climate change and speicies extinction. The earths finite resources can not sustain the population growth X the average standard of living (consumption and waste).

There are clearly cycles of change within nature, but has there ever been animal that has inhabited earth that has been able to manipulate it's environment the way we do? Is there hope of reversing the impact of man, or are we by virtue of fact that greed is part of human nature, destined to drown in our own waste?
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Postby alextemplet » Wed Jan 21, 2009 1:32 pm

MrB wrote:There are clearly cycles of change within nature, but has there ever been animal that has inhabited earth that has been able to manipulate it's environment the way we do? Is there hope of reversing the impact of man, or are we by virtue of fact that greed is part of human nature, destined to drown in our own waste?


We have the capability to reverse the damage we have done to the environment, although it might still be too late for some species. Which raises another point, many scientists believe we are beginning to see a mass extinction in addition to climate change. We can change it, but from what I've seen of human nature, we probably won't.
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Postby mcar » Mon Jan 26, 2009 3:29 am

A year or a two, if we stop all the processes that contribute to global warming, the chances of reversing is great. Although the question here is, when?
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Re: Anthropogenic global warming?

Postby JorgeLobo » Wed Jan 28, 2009 10:20 am

alex and mcar - prove it. Like to see the stiochiometry of that, short of ending our civilization presence on earth suddenly. Even had the Kyoto protocol been adhered top religiously, it would have had no significant effect on the projections of global warming effect. Emissions continued to grow since then, and please remember our carbon emissions and vastly more were once in the atmosphere as carbon dioxide.

Love the emotional mea culpa of "damage we've done".
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Postby mcar » Wed Jan 28, 2009 1:47 pm

Well, I just think of a very simple natural process where plants--our very own photosynthetic organisms that can definitely perform the healing process. I just wonder however the present percentage of CO2 already present in our atmosphere. Two or three decades ago, researches suggest that the atmospheric amount of CO2 is far more less than what we have today. The problem is, we can't really stop carbon emissions since most of our activities generating our lifestyle makes most of the gas. If in a year or a two we try stopping our activites, everything for us would be definitely ruined. It's really a hard thing actually because instead of making the simple natural process work for the best, we try to think of an alternative approach that has the same effects as what the plants can actually do. The more complex the alternative we think of, the more expensive it becomes and the more scientific principles that we have to think about, in terms of physical and chemical relationships that it connect to our alternative plan.
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Re: Anthropogenic global warming?

Postby JorgeLobo » Wed Jan 28, 2009 4:09 pm

"Healing"???? I think that subjective term speaks well to the general absence of any realistic assessment of the matter. What technical approaches have you considered, both in practical application and potential - or was this just subjective?
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Postby alextemplet » Thu Jan 29, 2009 1:24 am

Some good examples of evidence for global warming would be the shrinking snow caps on most mountains and changes in the migration patters of many animals to correspond with warmer weather.
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Postby mcar » Fri Jan 30, 2009 9:13 am

If we can possibly stop or at least reduce all carbon emissions and convert all of our dependencies on renewable sources of energy just to lessen the contributing factors to global warming. Just walk instead of riding an automobile, reduce electrical consumption, develop innovative ways of reusing things, althought this last one may really require greater expenses. Educating our people about the situation pays a lot but the response may take time. Politically, the agenda towards healthy environmental prospects are not the real concerns of the most influential leaders that we have. We may produce lots of plans or objectives for the next 10 years just to make a renewed environment but the thing is it's not successfully followed or enhanced however.
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Postby JorgeLobo » Sat Jan 31, 2009 3:19 pm

Come on mcar. You're not in high school. These trivial de minumus actions may make you feel good - even superior - but the math doesn't add up here. Politically - this is a hot issues - leaders carry no greater concern than that.
Bottom line - every little bit does NOT help. If we want to seriously attack the issue, these are distractions that lose focus on real solutions.
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Re: Anthropogenic global warming?

Postby mcar » Mon Feb 02, 2009 12:46 am

Why are you so hot? Remember that no two individuals are the same. You can not let others think the way you want. If you want to teach, know your disciples including their needs and readiness.
I never thought being superior here as well. Honestly, it made me realize that I have so many things to learn and to understand.
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