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fetus with gill

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fetus with gill

Postby kiekyon » Sun Mar 05, 2006 7:45 am

does human fetus really have gills??
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Postby Khaiy » Sun Mar 05, 2006 7:48 am

There is a point in human development in the womb where gills are present. I'm not sure if it's in the fetal stage or not, but they are there at one point.
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Postby kiekyon » Sun Mar 05, 2006 8:07 am

then, does this prove that human evolved from fish??
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Postby MrMistery » Sun Mar 05, 2006 7:25 pm

not directly, but in a way yes. I'm sure a ID debater would find a way to refute this as they do to everything else...
But generally, ontogeny repeats phylogeny
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Response

Postby Melychath » Sun Mar 05, 2006 11:54 pm

Evolution will be proven about as soon as the existence of God is proven. Both are based on faith, faith that what the interpreter has seen, experienced and learned are truth. There can only be one truth, if indeed there is a truth. Was all of creation spawned from absolutely nothing? Did the very first piece of matter simply appear from nothing? How logical is it to assume that, in the light of the intricate designs inherit in every aspect of creation, that everything we see, and know, and everything we have yet to see, and know, all had its' beginning in mere chance?
The Big Bang was not the beginning, there had to be some action prior to those forces involved in that collision, some action that created those very elements involved in the Big Bang. The beginning, if evolution is accurate, had to come with a solitary element of matter springing from nothing, which then evolved into larger, and more complex substances, which down the road formed those elements involved in the Big Bang, which then created the life we understand today.
To me, believing that an omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent God, whom I may never be capable of fully comprehending, created life, is much easier to swallow than the idea formerly expressed.
No disrespect meant here. And, sorry that this is way off topic.
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Postby mith » Mon Mar 06, 2006 1:48 am

You're free to delete your post if you feel it is off topic.
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Enjoying one moment at a time;
Accepting hardships as the pathway to peace;
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Postby kiekyon » Mon Mar 06, 2006 2:50 am

but, could it be the gill is the result of, ermm what is the term?
u know, 2 different species evolving separately but eventually arrive at the same result??
and does the gill serves any purpose??
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Postby alextemplet » Mon Mar 06, 2006 4:19 am

Ouch . . . My brain exploded.

I warned you guys this might happen if we started another creation debate. Now I have to spend the rest of the night trying to superglue my head back together. I am not looking forward to work tomorrow.
Generally speaking, the more people talk about "being saved," the further away they actually are from true salvation.

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Postby damien james » Mon Mar 06, 2006 6:31 am

kiekyon wrote:but, could it be the gill is the result of, ermm what is the term?
u know, 2 different species evolving separately but eventually arrive at the same result??
and does the gill serves any purpose??


I think that is convergent evolution.
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Postby kiekyon » Mon Mar 06, 2006 8:21 am

thanks damien.. that's it
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Gills

Postby Doc44 » Mon Mar 06, 2006 4:47 pm

Ontogeny Recapitulates Phylogeny

Developing vertebrate fetuses show pairs of gill arches. In lower vertebrates the arches have openings between them and the bars develop and persist as gills as in fishes. In higher vertebrates the arches develop tissue between the bars forming gill pouches and clefts. These arches develop into other structures in the higher vertebrates, such as the jaw in the gnathostomes and the ear in the amphibians and higher vertebrates.

More reading......

http://mcraeclan.com/Graeme/Language/On ... logeny.htm

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Evolution is essential for the continuation of "life" in an ever changing environment.
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Postby MrMistery » Mon Mar 06, 2006 8:35 pm

ok, i will not debate on ID, however i will debate on the Big Bang. Think of the Earth isolated from the rest of the universe. What is left of the Earth if you don't consider the rest of the universe? Nothing? Wrong! You can not say that that spot contains something or not, because you can not define that spot. Just as you can not define anything as being 2 meters left of the universe.

Now, time is similar to space. Moments before the big bang simply can not be defined. You can not say that something was or was not there at that point, because that spot in space-time is simply not defined, similar to a mathematical function.
For more details see "a short history of time" by Stephen Hawking. Good book and easy to understand
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