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The big Challenge in Biology

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The big Challenge in Biology

Postby hashemyemen » Fri May 07, 2010 5:53 pm

Central Dogma said " Proteins cannot be synthesized without DNA witch will be expressed into mRNA via transcription and then this mRNA will be translated into proteins using amino acids formation via polypeptide bonds " .

Question here is, when we talk about the origin of life, which one came before the other? Proteins or DNA??

If Proteins, then who did they synthesized without transcriptions, translations processes? I.e How did amino acids bounded without the process of protein synthesis??

If DNA, how did the nucleotide sequences formed in the beginning??


Just, think about it :wink:

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Postby JackBean » Fri May 07, 2010 6:49 pm

read about RNA world ;)
http://www.biolib.cz/en/main/

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Re:

Postby hashemyemen » Fri May 07, 2010 7:15 pm

JackBean wrote:read about RNA world ;)



I know it of course, but it is not giving a single piece of explanation for such inquiry. :D
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Postby JackBean » Fri May 07, 2010 8:31 pm

1) why didn't you mention it then?

2) doesn't it?
http://www.biolib.cz/en/main/

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Re:

Postby hashemyemen » Sat May 08, 2010 12:47 pm

JackBean wrote:1) why didn't you mention it then?





Another question, did RNA came first or DNA :)

If I mentioned RNA I could had said then that it is responsible for the existent of proteins of course, but where did this RNA came from? How is it originated since we know that RNA needs DNA for its synthesis ?


Now, the question is modified :

Which one came before the other, DNA, RNA, or proteins ? :o

Think about it :wink:
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Postby kolean » Sat May 08, 2010 2:51 pm

My thinking is that proteins were first. Actually, I want to say molecules came together first. Now there was no replicating/copying oneself at this time. It was just a hit or miss type of thing with chemicals bonding and randomly producing complexes. Perhaps, enzymes were the first proteins to replicate. Repeating themselves in their functional capacity, and thus polymerizing (and perhaps breaking off and making more of themselves - as long as the environment could support such growth). RNA was probably next (though this is evolutionary years down the path) and then a permanent DNA molecule for stably procreating the genome.
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Re:

Postby hashemyemen » Sat May 08, 2010 9:08 pm

kolean wrote:My thinking is that proteins were first. Actually, I want to say molecules came together first. Now there was no replicating/copying oneself at this time. It was just a hit or miss type of thing with chemicals bonding and randomly producing complexes. Perhaps, enzymes were the first proteins to replicate. Repeating themselves in their functional capacity, and thus polymerizing (and perhaps breaking off and making more of themselves - as long as the environment could support such growth). RNA was probably next (though this is evolutionary years down the path) and then a permanent DNA molecule for stably procreating the genome.



Randomly? Without external factors? How is it possible?


At least there must be some environmental factors effected the bonding of such organics and chemicals, but what were they?


Still, we need to think :)
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Postby JackBean » Sun May 09, 2010 6:31 am

I agree with kolean, except that I think the first such molecule was RNA, because RNA has ability to self-replicate, not proteins
http://www.biolib.cz/en/main/

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Re:

Postby hashemyemen » Sun May 09, 2010 9:52 am

JackBean wrote:I agree with kolean, except that I think the first such molecule was RNA, because RNA has ability to self-replicate, not proteins



No dear, always and always, RNA needs DNA for its synthesis via the process of transcription...

Without DNA's template strand, RNA cannot be synthesized..

Again, we need to think about it.

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Re: The big Challenge in Biology

Postby kolean » Sun May 09, 2010 2:44 pm

hashemyemen wrote:Randomly? Without external factors? How is it possible?

Where did I say no external factors? It is all external factors. It is the environment. It is the environment (full of molecules just laying around) bumping into molecules and getting 'hooked' up. It is carbon with its giving and receiving +4/-4 outer electron shell that started partying with all the other molecules. It is probably "pockets" of carbon with atmospheric nitrogen getting together to form the first amino acid. Then that amino acid bumped into another amino acid, and a baby protein was made (and at a chemical Rave party a really long polypeptide was made and formed a 3D protein complex). Then next was a polypeptide of RNA, along with the protein polypeptide. Now the real question is when did proteins and RNA/DNA find a way to start reproducing oneself.
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Re: The big Challenge in Biology

Postby hashemyemen » Sun May 09, 2010 10:31 pm

kolean wrote:
hashemyemen wrote:Randomly? Without external factors? How is it possible?

Where did I say no external factors? It is all external factors. It is the environment. It is the environment (full of molecules just laying around) bumping into molecules and getting 'hooked' up. It is carbon with its giving and receiving +4/-4 outer electron shell that started partying with all the other molecules. It is probably "pockets" of carbon with atmospheric nitrogen getting together to form the first amino acid. Then that amino acid bumped into another amino acid, and a baby protein was made (and at a chemical Rave party a really long polypeptide was made and formed a 3D protein complex). Then next was a polypeptide of RNA, along with the protein polypeptide. Now the real question is when did proteins and RNA/DNA find a way to start reproducing oneself.



May be, but you have changed the main direction of my question.

I asked " how did the nucleotide sequences formed in the beginning? "

I was not concentrating on amino acids like i did on nucleic acids, How they formed !

Meanwhile, what were those environmental factors which assisted the organic elements to form a complete amino acids? And if we apply them again in lab, can they do the same job of synthesizing amino acids form the organic elements? this is the real question and looking for our answers. :)


Again we need to think :wink:
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Postby hashemyemen » Mon May 10, 2010 2:03 pm

Watch this and tell me what you think about it :-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPh8N5x6PD4
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