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Where did life start?

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Where did life start?

Postby TheVirus » Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:55 pm

Anybody knows how, when and/or where did life begin? I've heard it started in water when a lightening or something struck some proteins or something and got them to bound together and create cell structures. Is is true? Are there other theories?
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Postby BIRKHADEM » Sat Nov 21, 2009 11:45 am

I'm not sure in our earth ( for human ), do you think els, tell me so!
If yuo have other suggestion you can tell me about it because I'm intersting about the life and specilly the passage procaryote to eucaryote.
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Re: Where did life start?

Postby Trevorlawrence » Mon Nov 23, 2009 3:11 am

Evidently the conditions of Earth were right and all that was needed was a kickstart. My bet is that organic molecules and amino acids arrived on Earth via the the early collisions that collectively helped form the Earth. Once the environmental conditions on the planet became more suitable, these materials managed to bind together forming the precursors of life.
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Postby plasmodesmata11 » Tue Nov 24, 2009 4:12 am

So there are really two theories
There's the prebiotic soup theory and the sulfur iron world hypothesis
I favor the soup, and here's why:
So our atmosphere contained all the necessary basic organic elements (SCHNOP), and for some beautiful reason organic compunds can spontaneously form when these are present. Two scientists, Miller and Urey, also devised their own, I believe, concrete PROOF that it is possible to form organic compunds when lightning is added in. Check it out on google or something for an in depth (it's simple, but neat and longer than I would like to explain) description. It is beautifully elegent, simple, and precise. And they did it with several of the suggested atmospheric contents 3.3 bilion years ago. These organic compounds, like basic proteins, AA, and RNA formed with the other necessary constituents to form these neat things called protobionts, a type of microsphrere.
Also google them; they are VERY intriguing. They demonstrate qualities of life, but yet are not considered living. These are agreed by some to be thwe definite precursors to life. It is agreed on by most that given the ingredients and time, something will happen.
And the iron sulfur world hypothesis? I suggest you google that too, but here are my thoughts...It suggests that life began in the bottom of the ocean, thriving off of hydrogen sulfide is it? Regardless, anyone else who reads this...
Do you think it is possible that these two forms of life evolved independently? I always wondered this...
There would be a suspicious convergence of evolution on the part of crabs, because there are the crabs that survive off the vents, and then the crabs you may catch while fishing. So I can see how this may be shot down... just wondering what all you guys thought
AND TO THE VIRUS
hope this helped
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Postby TheVirus » Fri Nov 27, 2009 2:21 am

Yeah, i heard about Miller and Urey and their life soup. It's interesting. But i guess it's something more than just an inorganic compounds juice and an electrical wire, right? I mean it can't be that simple.
”It is not the strongest of the species that survives, nor the most intelligent that survives. It is the one that is the most adaptable to change.”
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Postby JackBean » Fri Nov 27, 2009 3:46 am

Why it couldn't be simple? Why do you think, it MUST be complicated?
You can't just say NOW I have complicated organic molecules and NOW I will evolve cell. Unless you're god...
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Postby TheVirus » Fri Nov 27, 2009 5:11 pm

nothing's simple
”It is not the strongest of the species that survives, nor the most intelligent that survives. It is the one that is the most adaptable to change.”
~Charles Darwin
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Postby plasmodesmata11 » Fri Nov 27, 2009 11:52 pm

Give something a few billion years, however, and aggregation of organic molecules apparently is bound to give rise to life
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Postby TheVirus » Sat Nov 28, 2009 2:22 am

unless there are enzymes involved, which would make it happen far earlier
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Postby JackBean » Mon Nov 30, 2009 6:10 am

And where do you get enzymes in enviroment, where are neither cells? :roll:
http://www.biolib.cz/en/main/

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Re:

Postby MackJ » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:52 pm

plasmodesmata11 wrote:So there are really two theories
There's the prebiotic soup theory and the sulfur iron world hypothesis
I favor the soup, and here's why:
So our atmosphere contained all the necessary basic organic elements (SCHNOP), and for some beautiful reason organic compunds can spontaneously form when these are present. Two scientists, Miller and Urey, also devised their own, I believe, concrete PROOF that it is possible to form organic compunds when lightning is added in. Check it out on google or something for an in depth (it's simple, but neat and longer than I would like to explain) description. It is beautifully elegent, simple, and precise. And they did it with several of the suggested atmospheric contents 3.3 bilion years ago. These organic compounds, like basic proteins, AA, and RNA formed with the other necessary constituents to form these neat things called protobionts, a type of microsphrere.
Also google them; they are VERY intriguing. They demonstrate qualities of life, but yet are not considered living. These are agreed by some to be thwe definite precursors to life. It is agreed on by most that given the ingredients and time, something will happen.
And the iron sulfur world hypothesis? I suggest you google that too, but here are my thoughts...It suggests that life began in the bottom of the ocean, thriving off of hydrogen sulfide is it? Regardless, anyone else who reads this...
Do you think it is possible that these two forms of life evolved independently? I always wondered this...
There would be a suspicious convergence of evolution on the part of crabs, because there are the crabs that survive off the vents, and then the crabs you may catch while fishing. So I can see how this may be shot down... just wondering what all you guys thought
AND TO THE VIRUS
hope this helped


Considering every life form on this planet uses the same genetic language, it's safe to say that we all evolved from a common ancestor and not from two forms of life.

Abiogenisis and the study of how life came to be on Earth is not nearly advanced enough to start picking what hypothesis's are right.

The problem I have with the Urey-Miller experiment is that a "soup" filled with amino acids and RNA+DNA monomers doesn't equal life. Nor does the spontaneous formation of a bilayer of lipids in an aqueous solution. The intricacies of transcription to translation in just a simple prokaryote are astounding and we are just beginning to understand those; trying to understand how it all started billions of years ago might never be answered.

In theory, the spontaneous formation of life violates the second law of thermodynamics. In no way should a self sustaining, self polymerizing, "genetic code" form out of a less complex system.
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Re:

Postby TheVirus » Tue Dec 01, 2009 12:02 am

JackBean wrote:And where do you get enzymes in enviroment, where are neither cells? :roll:

Upps. Touché.
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