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Postby MichaelXY » Wed Dec 12, 2007 1:30 am

To save the fish we need to find this guy a project. Put on thinking caps.
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Postby locobw » Wed Dec 12, 2007 1:40 am

Dude i already got a project i'm gonna do but i didn't know killing fish that i already have wasn't a good idea but i mean it's science you do stuff like that.
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Postby MichaelXY » Wed Dec 12, 2007 2:29 am

Ok, I got one for you. Determine the affects of electromagnetism on fish. Place a electromagnet in the center of the tank, and observe the reaction of the fish. Just be sure to not to use greasy dirty stuff to stick in the tank, afterall we do not want to kill the fish.
Perhaps in addition you can make the same observation with just a plain magnet.
Also consider this. I have taken it from
http://www.apa.org/science/anguide.html

Justification of the Research

A. Research should be undertaken with a clear scientific purpose. There should be a reasonable expectation that the research will

a) increase knowledge of the processes underlying the evolution, development, maintenance, alteration, control, or biological significance of behavior

b) determine the replicability and generality of prior research

c) increase understanding of the species under study; or

d) provide results that benefit the health or welfare of humans or other animals.
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Postby mith » Wed Dec 12, 2007 5:13 am

We also learned a similar set of guidelines in my ethics course

one should also consider replacing higher animals with lower animals and also whether the study is redundant(duplicates previous research).
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Accepting hardships as the pathway to peace;
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Postby locobw » Fri Dec 14, 2007 1:17 am

Hey guys I got one more question what would be the purpose of the project? How does it affect the real world to put a magnet in a fish tank?

Pleas tell me cause i think it's pointless
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Postby MichaelXY » Fri Dec 14, 2007 1:32 am

Fish seem to have the ability to perform feats of Navigation. How are they able to do this? One thing for sure is that the planet is one big magnet. Do the fish somehow sense this? I know sharks have a strong sensor for electromagnetism, the ampullae lorenzini. It was just a thought. Good question though. Maybe someone else has other ideas for a project. What is your timeline?
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Postby locobw » Fri Dec 14, 2007 11:03 pm

Well the project is due February the 22nd.
Also I asked the science teacher if the magnet was a good idea she said, " what if nothing happens how long will u observe it?" So i'll email the teacher

P.S: yah i remember last year we learned about how Birds migrate and know where norht and south are
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Postby locobw » Fri Dec 14, 2007 11:22 pm

noaughty boy-- i'm mispellind in purpose
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Postby locobw » Sat Dec 15, 2007 4:55 am

Hey guys this is my purpose. Tell me what you think.

The purpose of this project is that i will see if the small magnet affects the aquarium the same way the magnetic field affects the world.I will see if their are any changes in the fish's behavior. I will also observe if the magnet weakens and loses its electromagnetism. Another thing I will observe is if the fish have a sort of change in navigation by that I mean if they like to sleep in the front of the tank or the back of the tank. Basically I will find out if the electromagnetism from the small magnet in the fish tank act like a magnetic field.

Also what kind of magnet should I use, like one of those kitchen magnets or like one of those really strong magnets, I was thinking the ones from the kitchen( not part of purpose)
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Postby mith » Sat Dec 15, 2007 8:18 am

Try varying the field strength, that would help you confirm/disconfirm your hypothesis.
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Postby MichaelXY » Sat Dec 15, 2007 8:33 am

In order to vary field strength as Mith says, you would need a electro-magnet.
http://www.howstuffworks.com/electromagnet.htm

As far a regular magnets. Neodymium magnets, also called rare earth magnets are the bomb. Maybe too expensive though, about 2-5 bucks. They can be found at electronic surplus stores. Maybe your teacher can help locate a source in your area for you. Here is one source for ordering online.
http://www.kjmagnetics.com/uses.asp
I would really like to hear how this works out for you. Good luck.
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Postby mith » Sat Dec 15, 2007 9:06 am

Before you set yourself on the course of this project, you should consider a couple of things.

How are you going to measure quantitatively change in behavior? Specifically what type of changes are you measuring? In this case you might want to observe initially if there's any sort of response before deciding on a unit of measurement.

What if there is no change in behavior? More often than not, this would be the norm. Be prepared to answer why this is the case and what other experiments you might need to test your hypothesis.

For example, in birds only some species such as pigeons can do this, but can all fishes? What if you used a different species of fish that also exhibits homing behavior such as salmon? You can also take a similar line of reasoning for types of magnets, and how you used the magnets.
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