Login

Join for Free!
118239 members


Brain size=IQ level theory (Blacks vs Whites & Asians)

Human Anatomy, Physiology, and Medicine. Anything human!

Moderator: BioTeam

Postby David George » Wed Dec 03, 2008 4:07 am

Thank goodness there was no mention about Indians. :lol: :lol:
"Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of evolution"
-Theodosius Dobzhansky
User avatar
David George
Coral
Coral
 
Posts: 317
Joined: Tue Feb 21, 2006 12:48 pm
Location: India [place where religion rules people]

Re: Brain size=IQ level theory (Blacks vs Whites & Asians)

Postby rabidbadger » Tue Jan 20, 2009 11:57 am

hi i have just stumbled accross this subject while doing some impartial research of my own.

I would just like to clarify a few points if i may

ok so we have

bluecafe669

and

J. PHILIPPE RUSHTON

with totaly oposing views on this subject


bluecafe seems to slip off the topic most of the way through his post
but is saying that african origined (for lack of better word) have large barin mass and that there skulls are larger. then he goes on to explain how the The gene microcephalin (MCPH1) has a large tendancy to mutate in african population which would explain the reduced brain size(although i would like to say he use the words cranial which is the bone structure and not the actual brain)

didnt he just say that the africans (blacks) had larger brains? how does that figure? if i choped off the bottom of my legs would i still put my hight down as 6ft?

i diverge anyway

it seems that all the people that have been refferenced by blue cafe are saying that all the studies havnt been totaly equal and that the negro population hasnt been represented accuratly due to disiese mutation and poor health, in my opion an acuarte sample of the african poulation.

i have gooogled Phillip V. Tobias which seems to be blues main source and havnt been able to find any of the data from his work and the only data that has been provide in this thread has been by tjj
which is

Table 1. S.J. Gould's ' corrected' final tabulation of Morton's assessment of racial differences in cranial capacity

Population Cubic inches Cubic centimeters

Native Americans 86 1410
Mongolians 87 1427
Modern Caucasians 87 1427
Malays 85 1394
Ancient Caucasians 84 1378
Africans 83 1361


as as from what i have been reading through gould is about as far left as you can get so its pretty relible conversion although the original data could of been modified at the source

for me to be totaly satisfied with a conclusion to this could anyone post a link to modern data related to this or where i can find it.


im sorry this hasnt been a particculary well structured/spelt post.
and am eager for more inforamtion
rabidbadger
Garter
Garter
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2009 11:18 am

Re: Brain size=IQ level theory (Blacks vs Whites & Asians)

Postby onetimepost1234 » Mon Mar 30, 2009 2:10 am

Its funny how blacks will talk about having a bigger penis and thats all cool when science shows its 1/2 inch larger on average, but the moment a study showing a 10-15 point IQ gap appears its suddenly offensive and racist. Science is science let the facts speak for themselves and quit putting lables on stuff which is just based on studies.

Thanks
onetimepost1234
Garter
Garter
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2009 2:03 am


Postby biohazard » Fri Apr 03, 2009 4:45 am

It's funny how someone manages to compare penises with brains.

You take a measuring tape, tell people to drop their pants and just size up their pecker. The only thing you gotta standardize is the state of the woody: limp or pointing up.

Now, with brains and IQ you have a million variables you need to standardize (like said here already a myriad times), which is practically impossible.

So whilst you can easily measure people's penises and proudly call it a scientific study, labelling a certain race more intelligent than another solely based on some IQ scores is far from a "fact"...
User avatar
biohazard
King Cobra
King Cobra
 
Posts: 776
Joined: Sun Apr 08, 2007 6:45 pm

Postby mith » Sun Apr 05, 2009 7:34 pm

Why does none of this data show any STDEV, how else are we supposed to see significance?
Living one day at a time;
Enjoying one moment at a time;
Accepting hardships as the pathway to peace;
~Niebuhr
User avatar
mith
Inland Taipan
Inland Taipan
 
Posts: 5345
Joined: Thu Jan 20, 2005 8:14 pm
Location: Nashville, TN

Re: Brain size=IQ level theory (Blacks vs Whites & Asians)

Postby Bob017 » Tue Apr 14, 2009 4:52 am

"This notwithstanding I cannot critisize the background of the paper, but I would like to point the fact that he author defends sir Cyril Burt who has admitted creating data does not plead for complete objectivity in the review."

Not true, Burt did not admit to creating data. Also, after he passed away one of his academic 'rivals' at his University had a large amount of Burt's papers destroyed. The whole episode has been discussed in a couple of books.

More interestingly though, subsequent twin studies have reached similar findings to Burt. Behavioural traits are significantly heritable.

"Behavioral genetics has repeatedly found that the “shared environment” — everything that siblings growing up in the same home have in common, including their parents, their neighborhood, their home, their peer group and their school — has less of an influence on the way they turn out than their genes. In many studies, the shared environment has no measurable influence on the adult at all. Siblings reared together end up no more similar than siblings reared apart, and adoptive siblings reared in the same family end up not similar at all. A large chunk of the variation among people in intelligence and personality is not predictable from any obvious feature of the world of their childhood." http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/11/magaz ... wanted=all

Also, it's worth mentioning that 'Mismeasure of Man' cited above is a badly flawed propaganda piece. Have a read of the various negative reviews which are linked on wikipedia.

David J. Bartholomew, from London School of Economics, who has writtena textbook on factor analysis, also explains in "Measuring Intelligence: Facts and Fallacies" where Gould goes wrong in this area.

Gould also makes some misleading comments about the early performance of Jewish migrants on psychometric tests. Goddard never found that Jews as a group did poorly, and there is no evidence the tests were used in passing the 1924 Immigration Act (see, Franz Samelson (1975, 1982), Snyderman & Herrnstein 1983).

Gould states that Morton "doctored" his collection of results on cranial size, but J. S. Michael (1988) remeasured a random sample of the Morton collection he found that very few errors had been made, and that these were not in the direction that Gould had asserted.
Bob017
Garter
Garter
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2009 4:43 am

Postby Bob017 » Tue Apr 14, 2009 4:56 am

Rushton & Ankney have published a new paper on this.

Rushton, J. P., & Ankney, C. D. (2009). Whole-brain size and general mental ability: A review. International Journal of Neuroscience, 119, 691-731.

http://psychology.uwo.ca/faculty/rushton_pubs.htm
Bob017
Garter
Garter
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2009 4:43 am

Re: Brain size=IQ level theory (Blacks vs Whites & Asians)

Postby bethrjacobs » Wed Nov 04, 2009 1:09 am

You know my I.Q. was wrongly told to me. I don’t know if the person out right lied but they had two standardized test to look at with in one point of each other. Standardized public school I.Q. tests and I didn’t know for almost twenty years that my I.Q. is actually ten points and an entire percentile higher then was stated to me. I believe it made me act “slower’ all these years…
Was this person also female a bigot; a sexist? I will never know.
My mother has an I.Q. of 165 but I believe she has been so discriminated against it’s impossible for her to even get close to what one could do with this. Not my mom but to the point. And these auditions are held behind a scrim…

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2005/aug/09/arts.gender
bethrjacobs
Garter
Garter
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 12:49 am
Location: New York state

Re: Brain size=IQ level theory (Blacks vs Whites & Asians)

Postby TheVirus » Wed Nov 04, 2009 3:18 am

Brain size does not always determine IQ. Women, for example have smaller brains than men, but theirs are more developed than men's.
”It is not the strongest of the species that survives, nor the most intelligent that survives. It is the one that is the most adaptable to change.”
~Charles Darwin
User avatar
TheVirus
Coral
Coral
 
Posts: 188
Joined: Sun Nov 01, 2009 4:23 pm

Re: Brain size=IQ level theory (Blacks vs Whites & Asians)

Postby bethrjacobs » Sat Nov 14, 2009 9:09 pm

…very nice Virus… :mrgreen:
bethrjacobs
Garter
Garter
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 12:49 am
Location: New York state

Re: Brain size=IQ level theory (Blacks vs Whites & Asians)

Postby beachlover » Sun Apr 04, 2010 2:01 pm

Brain Size Matters: a Reply to Peters
by J. Philippe Rushton and C. Davison Ankney
University of Western Ontario


'Rushton (1995) reviewed 100 years of scientific literature and found that across a triangulation of procedures, brains of East-Asians and their descendants average about 17 cm3 (1 in3) larger than those of Europeans and their descendents whose brains average about 80 cm3 (5 in3) larger than those of Africans and their descendents. Although critics can pick outliers to show counter-examples and suggest opposite trends (as could critics of a statement that men are, on average, taller than women) the aggregated data are clear (see Rushton, 1995, for full discussion of alleged counter examples).'

'Globally, racial differences in brain size parallel those found in measured intelligence. Europeans in North America, Europe and Australasia have mean IQs of around 100. For East Asians, measured in North America and in Pacific Rim countries, means range from 101 to 111. Africans living south of the Sahara, African-Americans and African-Caribbeans (including those living in Britain), have mean IQs of from 70 to 90 (Lynn, 1991). Elementary speed of information processing in 9- to 12-year-olds, in which children decide which of several lights stands out from others, show that racial differences in mental ability are pervasive. All children can perform the tasks in less than 1 s, but more intelligent children, as measured by traditional IQ tests, perform the tasks faster than do less intelligent children. Japanese and Hong Kong children have faster decision times (controlling for movement time) than do British and Irish children who have faster decision time than South African Black and African-American children (Jensen, 1993; Jensen & Whang, 1993; Lynn, 1991).'

For the record, I fit firmly into the group that comes 'second'.
beachlover
Garter
Garter
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Apr 04, 2010 1:58 pm

Re: Indians

Postby beachlover » Sun Apr 04, 2010 2:07 pm

David George wrote:Thank goodness there was no mention about Indians. :lol: :lol:



C'mon David, I'm including you in 'east asians' - top of the pile!
beachlover
Garter
Garter
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Apr 04, 2010 1:58 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Human Biology

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests