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Does every species have same number of heart beats?

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Does every species have same number of heart beats?

Postby Chris4 » Wed Jun 01, 2005 7:15 pm

My teacher used to say that he thought all animals have the same number of heart beats before they die. for example. a mouse lives a shorter life than humans but its heart beats something like 200 beats a minute. So its total number of heart beats may be the same.
He was an english teacher btw.:lol:

At the time I saw that this may often be the case, but I came up with one or two animals where the theory seemed to fall apart.
Can anyone think of any? I think birds may have a fast heart rate but some can live for 30 odd years. But maybe their heart rate is only twice as fast. :?

Any thoughts on this interesting theory? :?
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Postby MrMistery » Wed Jun 01, 2005 8:15 pm

I hate to dissapoint your english teacher but this is a stupid theory. Heart rate is bigger if the animal is smaller. So basically what you need is a small animal that lives long. A humming bird's heart beats 2000 times/minute in normal conditions. It can live up to ten years. You do the math
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Postby Chris4 » Wed Jun 01, 2005 10:25 pm

MrMistery wrote:I hate to dissapoint your english teacher but this is a stupid theory. Heart rate is bigger if the animal is smaller. So basically what you need is a small animal that lives long. A humming bird's heart beats 2000 times/minute in normal conditions. It can live up to ten years. You do the math


The point with the heart rate being bigger if the animal is smaller is part of the theory as they dont live as long as large animals which have a slower heart rate.
That was my point in animals like a humming bird.

I think there are people who believe the theory
http://www.uh.edu/engines/epi1834.htm

mouse 500 beats a minute
4 years life span
1,051,200,000

elephant - 30 beats, 69 years
1,087,992,000

So it is 1 billion for animals apart from humans who have 3 billion. Because we mature more slowly and maybe its because we are more evolved.

Btw. i found that the average life span of a hummingbird is 3 years and 1260 beats a minute. I also found 6-12 years and 500-1200 beats a minute. I've closed all the links but they are the first few hits on google if you search on google for hummingbird info on life span and heart rate.
Im not saying you are wrong MrMistery, but it seems that hummingbirds are not a good example to use in this study. (too many contradicting results).
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Postby biostudent84 » Wed Jun 01, 2005 11:22 pm

Interesting theory. It would be neat to learn more.
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Postby Poison » Thu Jun 02, 2005 8:54 am

If we are talking about the rate all through the life, that can be correct. So, according to this, people who like sports will live shorter. so, should we sit on our places and move as less as possible? :?:
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Postby Chris4 » Thu Jun 02, 2005 9:43 am

Poison wrote:If we are talking about the rate all through the life, that can be correct. So, according to this, people who like sports will live shorter. so, should we sit on our places and move as less as possible? :?:


I was wondering whether someone would mention people who play sports. Although professionals will be pushing their heart rates to the maximum for hours during the day their resting heart rate will be much lower. About 40 beats a minute while they sleep.
Your resting heart rate is a measurement of how fit you are. As you exercise more it will decrease.
So it works out in the end.
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Postby b_d_41501 » Thu Jun 02, 2005 3:24 pm

Interesting theory indeed. Maybe these numbers have some sort of a relation to PHI, the Divine Proportion (1.618). All sorts of numbers in nature have some sort of a relation to this incredible number.
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Postby MrMistery » Fri Jun 03, 2005 8:11 pm

A great thing with Phi... It is the answer to the equation: x^2 -x -1=0. I did some research on this and cam up empty.
About that humming bird... My soruse is a university vertebrate zoology book. I suggest you check a zoology book(preferebly a university course, since high-school books tend to have lots of mistakes). Of course my book can be wrong :D
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Postby Chris4 » Fri Jun 03, 2005 11:55 pm

MrMistery wrote:A great thing with Phi... It is the answer to the equation: x^2 -x -1=0. I did some research on this and cam up empty.
About that humming bird... My soruse is a university vertebrate zoology book. I suggest you check a zoology book(preferebly a university course, since high-school books tend to have lots of mistakes). Of course my book can be wrong :D


MrMistery wrote:A great thing with Phi... It is the answer to the equation: x^2 -x -1=0. I did some research on this and cam up empty.
About that humming bird... My soruse is a university vertebrate zoology book. I suggest you check a zoology book(preferebly a university course, since high-school books tend to have lots of mistakes). Of course my book can be wrong :D


Fair enough. I'd go with the university text book anyday. But if you use 2000 beats per minute and 10 years it doesnt fit with the 1 billion heart beats theory :lol:
I guess most humming birds dont live that long, just a few lucky ones :P
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Postby MrMistery » Sat Jun 04, 2005 8:47 am

Look, this theory is actually a simple coincidence. The bigger the animal is, the slower his heart beats, that is a known fact. But big animals are usually 3rd or 4th consumers(top of the food chain). Ecology 101: you go up the food chain the size increasez, the number decreases. Being fewer of them it is normal that they live long(as we know competition reduces life span dramatically). So the number of heart beats would depend on a lot of factors, most of which, from an ecology point of view, is the size of population. In a popupulation of 10000 humming birds that feed on 200 flowers the individuals will live less than in a population of 100 living on the same number of flowers.
You have too many variables. If you do it for 50 different animals you will see that the numbers do not match
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Postby Chris4 » Sat Jun 04, 2005 10:45 am

I know its a coincidence. Im not taking it seriously. altho it may look like i am :D

I don't know much about ecology etc. But small animals which would have competition in the wild only live for a few years in captivity even with perfect food, water and living conditions. Why do they not live longer with no competition? (if it plays such a big role). Is it just nature? They've evolved to live that many years and it wont change now? Just ideas. :)
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Postby MrMistery » Sat Jun 04, 2005 6:19 pm

A human given good food will live longer than one who is starving(80 years compared to 60 for example) but it would not live for 200 years. Like so, animals in captivity will live longer, but their genes also play a part. A lion lives about 20 years in the wild. In captivity it lives for up to 40 years
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